I had mentioned in a previous post that I would be posting a discussion that I had with my under graduate classmates about the denial of visa to Mr. Modi who is the Chief Minister of the State of Gujarat in India. I personally and almost all the people involved in this discussion have no love lost for Mr. Modi who you could say is a scaled down version of Hitler. The topic of the discussion was on the ethical issues involved in dening visa to a foreign official by the US government.
Hey mates,
Just for time pass… What do u think about the decision made by U.S in denying visa to Narendra modi. For those who don’t know him he is the chief minister of gujarat.
I personally think it is a decision made against indians… i can site many reasons for this. But please i am doing this to keep mails floating… if it is not worthy of a discussion then lets talk something else…
Badri
Time is 1315 hrs GMT
Hi badri,
I support ur argument, just for the sake of supporting an Indian Leader (in distress!)! But, personally, i dont care what happens to this person, who was (allegedly) involved in the death (MURDER!) of so many innocent ppl for just (dirty) political reasons!!
Regards,
Anitha
Hey Guys,
Somebody has to play the devil’s advocate, so I’ll do it 😉 and oppose your views :). Firstly, I don’t know how u can call it a insult to our nation, when most of the opposition to his visit came from Indian’s in the US? You mean to say that the Indian’s wanted India to be insulted. Technically I think the government was right in lodging a protest, personally I would say hang that guy. He is something that the “Indian” supreme court has called the modern day Nero. I know BJP is trying to project it as a National Swaabhiman, but did day organise anything like that when Gujrat burned?? Or is this double standard. Is Narendar Modi more important that the 2000 or more people who died in the train fire and the subsequent riots?? Maybe you can claim that the US is not the one to judge it. But then if the Indians inside can’t do anything, then the Indians outside will try to do something …
Badri good idea da(Tamil slang for man/dude) …
NoViCe
Time stamp : 9:06 AM CST
Hey mates,
The reason given by U.S for visa denial is the findings of NHRSC(National Human rights Commision) . It is a one under govt of india. I 100% agree to the fact that he(modi) is a very ugly and a bad man of bad ideas and other stuff. But when sinn fein leader and musharaff are welcomed in U.S and the reason cited for the visa denial for a person elected by people(100 or 1000 or 100000) shows to methe way in which Uncle Sam see us. I don’t say that denial to modi is a disgrace to all indians, but I wanted to point out the dual standard maintained by U.S. (no offense). But, whoever is big and talks loud people or world tends to listen to him. right so when uncle says that a visa to an indian is rejected because of the “extremism” done by a person why don’t they do it for other people. This is just question arising in my head. I truely feel that they could have handled this issue differently.
Badri
Time is 1830 Hrs (GMT)
Hey all,
I do agree with you Badri on the point that it is double standards. What it all comes down to is economics. But thats all I can agree with you about. This is a big fiasco. Do you think that the US would have reacted in the sameway if we had rejected visa to one of the US Governor’s? No they would not have a pubic meeting to cry like a wimp and just bad mouth US in some distant rural area. But they would have taken some bold steps to retaliate. In India this has been turned in a fisaco, with people starting all this swabhimaan rallies et all. Do u think the US gives a damn about that? they could care less.
There is another angle to it. I don’t know if you have read but the sinn fein leader has got quite a snub this time around becasue some of his own country people have been lobbying for changes. Same way as the coalition against genocide did it against modi. The website is at http://www.coalitionagainstgenocide.org/. You could just say that the sangh parivar’s lobbyists were not as as persuasive as the anti-sangh group of Indians. So its basically another group of Indians who are claiming victory. what do u think about that ???
Ulysses
Hey uly,
Being a devils advocate u seems aruging well. but the fact is if a country is not granting a visa for a top level people(political) in a country the reson should be good. The country cann’t jude a person from another country. doesnt matter if modi is good or bad, but india IPC had judged the case, so if they try to prosecute him on any basis its not far on indian law.
I agree with you and i know US govt wont give a damn about this, but still there are so many eurpoean and arab nations condemed the act of invasion(iraq war). But still no one did this for bush …
This arguement will continue for ever, but the fact is no country should judge a person other than his own country.. Granting a visa should strictly follow the immigration law. If modi has a criminal case against him or any other criminal records on can be used as evidence to cancel his visa application.
According to my knowldege there is no case filed against modi in US as well, so seems not far, US is trying to prove a point that, americans are superior than other human races…. which i strongly disagree.
Rubesh
it s a right judgement
it s not an insult to India. it s great judgement whether he s big politician or small man like us see u guys, oneday our primeminister may also be denied VISA days have come for BJP PM, they politicize it ofcourse it s a lesson to other country and other politicians/business man/anyone in india
i welcome US judgement
Guru
and ruby good point mate.. uly it is not that modi is good or bad it is wrong for uncle sam to say that he is bad and ugly (and citing from NHRSC as reason) and so he is denied visa into u.s. as if u.s is a very peace loving country and they haven’t done anything bad in this world. i get irritated when they try to act as the salt of the earth but the fact is they are not. I know we will have a lot of disscussion, it is not about modi or BJP or sang parivar or other religius or ‘extremists’ group. it is the way in which the govt of u.s thinks about an indian. they want to prove their superiority which i honestly dislike. and what i read in the nhrsc findings were, modi didn’t do all he can do to stop the riots. and that is wrong. and it never said he had hand in the killings. i agree that being the c.m he should have done more. but again it is an internal matter within india and indians.
Here in northern ireland there was a killing of a person and IRA men were involved in that so when normnally on ‘St.Patricks day’ president will invite Sinn fein leader but he didn’t do it this time because of political honesty(idu oru porvai). and one more thing IRA has funding from people of united staes and that is why govt of u.s doesn’t see killing of people in united kingdom as genocide. rather a religious upliftment. and what about musharaff.. is he not responsible for the wiping out of the whole kashmiri pandits in jammu and kashmir. but there are no governing body to see this because it comes under freedom of kashmir. and is he not a terrorist(he got hold of the government in a coup. ofcourse, which is wrong if it happened in india)
Badri
0915 hrs GMT
Modi, the C.M of Gujarat was elected democratically to lead the state ….unlike Musharraf, he didn’t orchestrate a coup nor did he win with very less percentage of difference like Bush(vs Al Gore)…Pity with an IDIOT at the helm of affairs US is suffering!!!
MKarthik
Hey guys,
I do agree with you that double standards have been used here. What it all boils down to is politics and who needs who more. They allow the saudis who are at the forefront of religious persecution to come in becasue they need their oil. They need musharraf a dictator and the head of a religious state to come in becasue of afghanistan. They allow Sinn Finn to come in because the Irish have a strong lobby in the US and they don’t casuse genocide. While Modi needs the US to invest in his state!
Ruby the Americans did use the immigration laws to deny the visa, it was not a ad hoc decision. I agree that they haven’t followed the same yardstick for everybody. If as you say they were judgin him, then there would have been a suit filed in a court in America. One more thing you have to remember is the Modi was democratically elected in India and not America. I believe that every country has the soverign right to decide who is welcome and who is not. If any Indian immigration law prevented George Bush form getting a visa then it can be used. Also you cannot claim that the american’s think that they are superior, because it was the Indian lobby in the US that pushed the state department to not grant the visa. So it only goes to show the growing strength of the Indians here. The global Indian finally does care what happens back home!
Badri you seem to have mistake terrorism for genocide, what happened in Gujrat in 2002 was a mini genocide, the IRA didn’t come even close to it. Becasue the IRA was never in power. And about musharraf, nothing like what happened in Gujrat happened in pakistan. Kashmir is part of India and its the terrorist who should be canned for it. Musharraf is responsible for it though, but its a technicality and has been overlooked.
Ulysses
The part I liked about this discussion was that the participants were from all parts of the globe. I am here in the US, Badri is in UK, Rubesh in Australia while Kartik, Guru and Anitha are in different parts of India.
Would love to hear if anybody else has any other opinion to add …
